NCh. Princely Moment

On Sale Now, asking price: $1,500,000

[color=red]Stud Prospect

Looking to enhance your stable with a stud prospect, look no further.
Princely Moment is up for sale.
Reasons why you may want him…
** $1.6 Million in Career Earnings
** Only 4 Victories away from Stud Qualification
** No Injuries to date
** Hasn’t shown any deterioration in performance
** May improve with Steeplechase
** Stakes winner at all distances from 5.5F to 11F
** Stakes winner on Fast,Good, and Wet Tracks
** Stakes winner at the best tracks: Belmont, Gulfstream, Churchill Downs
** Treated like a baby, not over-raced, not over-travelled
** May improve with equipment changes…36 of 37 career starts were with NO EQUIPMENT

Just a heads up from someone who looked at Princley Moment with interested, but saw the price and thought twice. You’re asking the same amount that he’s earned for a 5 year old. He’ll be 6 next year and the chances of him finishing off his stakes wins to qualify for stud are slim. I considere $750,000 a more fair price for him, and even that is too rich for my blood for this particular stallion.

Thank you for the interest and considerate response.
The price tag was set at $1.5M for several reasons including potential stud, unknown steeplechase prospects and the fact that I’m not desperate to get rid of this horse. If my market price is too high, I will find out and will act accordingly by either lowering it or taking him off the market.
Further his earnings may not be as high as they should be because I like to give my horses(especially great ones) a good amount of rest between starts and train them. I pick and choose my races, which helps me rank as a top stable in hitting the board with my runners.  I could have run this horse 2x as much as I have in the past and he probably would have near double earnings…

Thank you again…and happy racing

On the other hand, he could be twice as good as he is, have double the earnings, and be stud qualified.  :wink:

He’s gorgeous! My bank account is nowhere near that price tag though :frowning:

Fair debate by all as to the value of this horse…One real indicator is whether or not he sells at this price or if at a lower one.

Lets See what happened when Princely Moment matched up against Nightfight($4.3M earner in 2010)

G2 Strub Stakes  Princely Moment 4th  Nightfight 6th        ADVANTAGE  PRINCELY  by 6 1/2 Lengths
G1 Pimlico Special Princely Moment 3rd  Nightfight 1st        ADVANTAGE NIGHT  by 5 1/4 Lengths
G1 Stephen Foster Princely Moment 3rd Nightfight 5th        ADVANTAGE PRINCELY by 6 3/4 Lengths
G1 Suburban Handicap Princely Moment 5th Nightfight 2nd  ADVANTAGE NIGHT by  16 3/4 Lengths
G1 Whitney Handicap  Princely Moment 8th Nightfight 1st  ADVANTAGE NIGHT by 28 Lengths
G1 Pacific Classic    Princely Moment 2nd Nightfight 3rd    ADVANTAGE PRINCELY by 4 3/4 Lengths
G1 Woodward        Princely Moment 5th Nightfight 3rd      ADVANTAGE NIGHT by 9 Lengths
G1 Jock Gold Cup    Princely Moment 5th Nightfight 1st      ADVANTAGE NIGHT by 50+ Lengths
G3 Stuyvesant      Princely Moment 4th Nightfight 2nd      ADVANTAGE NIGHT by 5 1/2 Lengths

Nightfight finishes ahead of Princely (6-3)…Somewhat respectable for Princely Moment

Still playing devil’s advocate here…you’re comparing apples to oranges…of the races you listed:

Nightfight finished off the board twice in those 9 starts (30% win, 78% on the board, 89% in the money).
Princely Moment, on the other hand, finished off the board 4 times (0% win, 33% on the board, 89% in the money).

Thus Nightfight having 4.3mil in earnings this year alone (and being stud qualified, and definitely worth 1.5mil+), and Princely Moment getting questions about the pricetag (having not even 1mil in earnings for this year).

The “argument” about PM’s price tag isn’t so much whether he’s worth the money (since he is a nice horse) but whether he stands a chance to earn back that money.  Nightfight has proven himself able to win big stakes even at age 6, he’s won over 10mil lifetime, and is likely to bring in at least $50,000-$100,000 per year in stud fees, depending on what fee Holly sets for him and how his foals do.  Even given that, Holly will likely still lose money on him for at least a few years at stud, if she nominates him for the Breeders’ Cup.

So…given Nightfight who is, stats-wise, 2 to 3 times better than Princely Moment (based on stakes wins or race earnings), and given the fact that he’ll still be costing his owner money at a stud career…you compare that to Princely Moment, who isn’t even guaranteed a stud career, and people are gonna be wary of plunking down the cash.

As you said, it’s all a question of supply and demand.  :wink:  There are pretty much always “almost” stud qualified colts available for purchase (including one in the upcoming Phoenix Farms auction, who’s actually stud qualified, rather than “has the potential to be stud qualified”).

Edited to add My point with the “he could be twice as good” comment above wasn’t to prompt you to compare him to a horse that is twice as good.  It was to point out that, in addition to your argument that he’s “possibly” worth 1.5mil simply because he could’ve run in twice as many races and potentially earned twice as much, he could actually be twice as good (i.e. Nightfight quality) and be worth 1.5mil even with limited starts.

I find this discussion rewarding for myself and the community of FF players. The whole question of “proper market price” for horses both on here or in “real” life never gets answered until after the purchase is made.
If I sell PM for $1.5, then it will take the buyer some time to recoup the expenses, and if he does go above and beyond ,then it was a good deal for the buyer. So, my price tag is high, I admit it. I think it is a risky investment(thats what it really is) for whomever may purchase him. Point really is, I would be happy to part with him for $1.5M. I would probably accept a lower amount and still be pleased. So, if in 4 days there are no buyers I will take him off the market…and re-assess the situation at a later date.
I’m happy that everyone can dicuss this in a non-offensive manner and take part in a good discussion.

I love Nightfight…a GREAT HORSE…Princely Moment is a few steps behind, and being a few steps behind is an achievement in itself

I agree with what Shanthi said-  supply and demand.  Right now I could go into the Pheonix Farms auction, throw down some money, and walk out with a stud-qualified horse.  I might spend more or less that what you’re asking for PM, but I wouldn’t really be taking such a big risk.  I also have Mistico Cigano, who is 3 and has 7 stakes wins.  Right now for me, and probably many of the stables in the game who could theoretically afford a 1.5 million dollar horse, I wouldn’t be willing to take the risk because I already have a horse who is in the same position, and could go for a horse who is less of a risk.  I think Princely Moment is a really, really nice horse, but right now with all the Pheonix horses coming up for sale soon, the foal auction just passed, and two more smaller auctions coming up, I just think you might have hit the wrong time with the market. 

I thought there was a guideline about this, I know other horses have been taken away from the owner for outrageous prices.  Also putting in there that horse must have the potential to make back the purchase price within 6 months. 

thanks for contributing…
I dont think this is a situation of outrageous pricing, and this horse can make back 1.5 Million in 6 months by winning the Dubai World Cup in March, this horse loves the dirt and 10F.
This horse has National Champion Title, I think outrageous pricing is more for the unproven horse.

That’s true, the guideline is more along the lines of horses who’ve earned $10,000 being sold for $75,000.  I figure if you’ve got 1.5 million in the bank, you’re either smart enough to spend it wisely, or you deserve to lose it.  :wink:

That said, saying Princely Moment could earn back his purchase price “just” by winning the DWC is a bit insane…he hasn’t won a stakes race since April, and has placed 5th in his two attempts at 10f since then.

there was a hint of sarcasm with the Dubai Victory comment… >:D

Good.  :wink:

As far as “unreasonably” priced horses… I also think Shanthi at one point said that if you put a horse up for what some might consider an unreasonable price, you also should put up a thread defending why you think the horse is worth that.  So, in this case, that’s been done. :slight_smile:

I believe she just said that y ou must be able to defend it.  And my words of a horse being able to earn back the purchase price with in 6 months was one of the questions posed, which is why I’ve posted that.  As seeing the horse hasn’t won a race since April, then the likely hood of a 5 yo soon to be 6 yo horse being able to earn back that money in 6 month isn’t likely. 

He’s not stud qualified as of yet, and there is a 50/50 chance of him getting there. Sorry to be a pain, but every so often I have to state my opinion.

I was planning to stay out of this conversation but I just wanted to say this: I bought MayIhavethisdance, an unplaced 2yo with out-of-the-game lines. His owner was asking $1 million for him and it was lowered to $0, which is how I got him. :slight_smile: Anyways, I don’t think PM’s price is anywhere near as outrageously priced as Dancer was but that was just my thoughts about Argus’s post.

Actually, you didn’t.  Final Furlong seized MIHTD because of the overpricing, and then placed him up for sale for $0 (I believe to new members only, but I could be wrong.)  So it wasn’t a massive change of heart by the owner or anything.  :wink:

Looks like I get to keep this beautiful horse…for that I’m Happy.
Just to let everyone know that I may put him back on the market at a later date…but…he is gonna cost more than 1.5M  >:D