Hey there I was wondering what is the average price of a 4 y/o mare that is not at the top of her game or either way??? SOrry Lindsay 
Remedyā¦
Again as to the HUGE post Shanthi made about wanting to buy horses:
More than likely this post will be deleted, but go searching for a 4yo mare, ask a price, and the owner will reply.
Lindsay
Price, especially for broodmare potential mares, varies enormously based on bloodlines.Ā On average though, Iād be VERY surprised if you could get a mare for under 50,000 and Iād say youāre doing well to get it for under 100,000, regardless of bloodlines/records.Ā Maiden 4yo mares or ones with 1 or 2 wins in 20-30 starts would be in the 50,000 range Iād expect as they just donāt make the cut for most established stables with a broodmare band.Ā Mares by stallions whoāve produced ANY MSW foals are likely abover 100,000, if theyāve got 1/2 sibs who are reliable runners/SP then Iād say youāre looking at over 200,000.
Ok, thanks for telling me. So now I know what iām looking at when it comes time. Comon My racers!!! I need a new broodmare:p
Thatās really great information Andrea.
I am curious. As broodmare prospects go, what is the thought on FF generated phenom mares like Daddyās Little Sta or Telescopic just to name a couple? Where is the value line drawn on something with no bloodlines to draw upon vs. a mediocre blueblood racemare?
I canāt speak for anyone else, but for meārace record is the most important thing to consider when purchasing a broodmare prospect.Ā If sheās done well, she obviously has the talent to pass it on to her foals.Ā She may not be passing a high percentage of those good traits, but if you start with a quality mare (read: one that runs and wins), chances are youāll probably get a better quality foal.
As for the blue bloods, thereās potential that they may be really nice broodies, but they have not exhibited having the talent on the track.Ā You may end up with a fabulous broodmare, or you may end up with a dud that throws duplicates of herself.
Thus, for me, performance trumps bloodlines.Ā For a consistent MSW mare Iād easily be willing to pay up to $750,000-$1,500,000 or more, but it really depends on her record and her earnings.Ā Depending on what lines, and if I was partial to them (such as Second Chance), I may pay a similar rate, but more than likely Iād max out at a lower benchmark, such as $300,000-$500,000.
I know Iām probably on the more conservative side of things, too.
Man, how do you get that much money???
I was basing my numbers on the assumption that a ānormalā mare went for $50,000-$100,000.Ā Also, if you look at auction prices they tend to be comparable.Ā My own budge is only about $2-3 million, so itās unlikely I would pay these prices on a normal basis.Ā Looking at my budget the most Iāve ever paid for a horse was $500,500 for a broodmare prospectāGo For Glory, a stakes winner and millionaire track horse and is half to several MSW horses.Ā However, this is an unusual purchase, as I usually spend $500-$150,000 on a horse.Ā Thereās only 4 horses since 12/06 on which Iāve spent more than this.Ā Iām not rolling in the dough, as my budget is only $2,300,000, so itās unlikely that Iād spend almost 1/2 of my budget on a horse.Ā However, these days horses, especially quality horses, have gone for top dollarāseveral million sometimes.Ā Thus, what Iām willing to pay and what others end up paying are two different things.
How did I earn it?Ā Luck.Ā Looking for cheap horses at auction and taking a low cost risk that ended up in big returns.Ā
Luck in the sense that I was somehow able to snag High Chances (2nd highest for # of SW in the game), for which Iām eternally grateful.
Cheap horses in the sense that I looked to buy the $500-$2,000 horses at auction, and hoped that I would come back with something good.Ā If someone outbid me, Iād swap to another forgotten horse.Ā Sometimes Iām very lucky.Ā For example for $500 I purchased Dark Continent at auction.Ā He was the first of his damās foals to run, and his stire was not a āhotā sire.Ā Heās now earned me $1.7 million and won 8 stakes wins.Ā I also managed to purchase MSW Determined and MSW Hollywood Native for $500.
But sometimes youāre unlucky, and you end up with horses that would prefer to run out of the gate backwards and eat the turf course rather than run.Ā If such is the case, after a certain period, you throw them into a claimer and see them off to a new home.Ā The fact that youāve only spent $500-$2,000 on them means that even if itās only a $5,000 claimer, youāre still making money.
When you buy a horse, racehorse, broodmare or otherwise, your first question should be: Can they earn this investment back?Ā If not, why are you paying that much?
Just a thought.Ā Good luck.
Because itās fun (read: insane) to pay $1,250,500-$2,500,000 on untried yearlings. 
Though I bought them purely based on their potential as broodmares. Obviously if they insist on only running out of the gate backwards their entire life, I might not be quite as happy with breeding them, but if nothing else, their foals should sell well, based on their bloodlines. 
Definitely no āaverageā price. Iād say that Oblivious, who runs out of the gate backwards in most races, is worth a lot, lot, lot less than Nudge Me.
(Not sure whether she counts as an āFF generated phenom mareā, butā¦close).
Heheh, I donāt disagree with you there, but only if you have the money to burn. The question was how I/we managed to get huge bankrolls, and I would argue that itās by NOT spending a whole lot ($100,000+) on horses. Once youāve got the gobs and gobs of money, then you can spend as you see fit. Also, those high price yearlings/weanlings have their bloodlines to back them up. So, itās not completely insane. Nice try, though. =)
I agree wtih that.Ā I also think that sometimes its better to step down and put your stakes horse in an allowance every once in a while.Ā Sometimes getting the winning purse for an allowance helps alot more than the 3rd or 4th in a stakes.Ā Thatās a lesson I canāt seem to pound into my own head haha, which is why I have alot in earnings but alot less in the bank.
I also have to say that auctions are not the best place to get broodmares.Ā People pay alot more for them there than the owner would actualy ask in just a private sale.
A nice ācheapā option is to lease mares, as well.Ā This can be a good way to get a very high-quality foal before you have 10+ million in the bank to spend buying a really nice mare.Ā Iāve leased out my mares (95% of whom are stakes winners or stakes producers) for as little as $50,000, depending on the mare (and, of course, as much as $1,000,000 
).Ā Obviously you only get one foal from the mare, but if itās a filly, youāve got an automatic broodmare right there.Ā And if itās a colt, you can hope he qualifies for stud, or you can geld him and hope he rakes in the money so that you can afford more mares.Ā 
A lot of owners donāt want to part with their mares (for good reason), but will generally be willing to lease them out for a year for the right price.
Definately agree with Shanthi on the leasing idea.Ā If you decide to do that, Iād suggest looking at mares that may have recently retired with average or slightly above average records.Ā Most of my SP mares I donāt want to sell until I see how their foals do, but I donāt necessarily want to 3 or 4 foals out of them while I wait.Ā Those are the type of mares Iām more inclined to lease out, and usually for a fairly cheap price.
Here, Here! I have leased out 2 mares this yearā¦ both for a fairly reasonable price. Plus I managed to claim a 4 year old mare that was just not making it on the trackā¦ I took a chance & retired her & bred herā¦ hopefully this gamble will pay off in a few yearsā¦
Being in FF less than a yearā¦ I have done alot of researchā¦ asked alot of owners about leasingā¦ most are wiling to lease if you are also breeding to one of their stallionsā¦
But you have to do the research & askā¦
Like when I asked an owner what she wanted for this one mare, I told her I would pay a good price. And I think she just blew me off like I was the brat in her life, that is kinda why iām afraid to ask people about there mare.
I think youāre a lot less likely to get blown-off if you have a specific price in mind that you can offer. I know to me this is the most important bit of information to both give and receive. That enables a potential seller to decide if that price is too low or just right, and help them make a decision accordingly. The only times Iāll ever delibearately ignore requests is if itās some one-line, five word PMā¦if someoneās not going to put the energy into even properly asking me something, Iām not going to worry about formulating an answer.
I understand where youāre coming from. Personally I really donāt like asking people for things, just because Iām shy and afraid of looking dumb (though for some reason that doesnāt keep me from posting to the forum ). It is confusing sometimes when you send off a request and donāt get an answer, but thatās rare in my experience, and it could just be because people are busy/forget/etc.
If privately negotiating things isnāt your cup of tea, then you just have to stalk the sales page, claimers, auctions etc. and keep your eyes out for opportunities. They will arise eventually if youāre patient.
Well I can relate on the feeling stupid or shot down but more often than not people are very kind if you go to them in a professional kind of way. But it is the best way to go. You can go for an auction but stock tends to be pricey at those events. Or you can wait around for a sale or claimer but you can get animals with much more potential if you make deals privately.
Now I have a question. This thread has sold me on leasing broodmares (Im actually thinking about pming a few now). But at what time do you make the exchange. Right after they foal right?
Okay, when I lease hereās what normally goes downā¦
- Select mare
- Contact mareās owner
- Discuss price
- Lease mare (at the moment there is no āleaseā feature as such so you technically simply buy the mare for agreed price)
- Breed mare
- Mare foals
- Send mare back to owner (at the moment this is simply achieved by offering mare for sale to owner only for $0)
Leasing is a great way to get some nice lines into your stable. My average for leasing a mare is usually $150,000 and up. I have paid $500,000 for a lease once though (at the time it was worth it and I think the horse turned into a MSW). Stud fees of course come on top of this. Interestingly, Iāve never actually talked with the owner about what happens in the event of a foal and/or mare death. You may want to come to an agreement regarding this with the owner (eg. 50% fee back for dead foal).
Have fun and good luck!
This is key. Personally, I know I have really nice stock. So if someone just asks out of the blue to buy/lease a horse of mine just 'cause theyāre nice, Iām generally going to respond with āsorry, not availableā. However, if they actually PM with something like āhey, I know this horse is worth X million dollars, but I really love her, can I possibly lease her for a year for, say, $30,000 to race/breed?ā then I know that 1) the person knows the value of the horse theyāre asking for (and theyāre not just randomly picking horses based on their names or something) 2) they arenāt going to steal the horse away forever and only give me peanuts in return. Iām especially receptive if the person has done enough research to know what theyāre getting.
i.e. āHey, Iāve looked at your horse, Hollywood Gold. I see that sheās had some really nice turf horses, and I want to breed a horse who can win the English Triple Crown. Could I lease her in 2011 for $75,000? Iād love to see how she does when bred to King David.ā
That shows me that the person has researched the horse a bit, has a plan for what theyāre planning on getting out of the breeding, and theyāve bothered to name a price so that I can say thatās too high/low/whatever.
Pretty much my rule of thumb is: however much effort the person seems to have put into asking me for a horse to lease/buy is how much I put in in responding. If they just ask to buy _____, Iām gonna say no, unless Iāve been really wanting to sell that horse for a while (which is unlikely, since if that were the case, theyād go on the sales page). However, if they actually show that theyāve done some effort, Iām at least going to consider their request, and possibly offer alternate options if the one they want isnāt available (i.e. if Iāve planned out Hollywood Goldās breeding schedule for the next 15 years or something ).